Written by Damian Monday, 23 November 2009 08:34
Morning all and before we tuck into very little football for breakfast, I have to mention this Alan Davies thing where he wrote something on Twitter referencing Celtic and Villa as little clubs. It is getting a mention because what struck me as surprising was it was our local media that picked up on this and our local media that continues to run wit it. Nobody else.
It was picked up by the Sunday Mercury. Why would our local newspaper want to start promoting this? I just don't understand, although after reading about it I did send a Tweet back to Mr Davies.
If you didn't know, he is an Arsenal fan and while he is referencing Celtic and Villa as little clubs, it is merely a delayed reaction to the realisation that his very own club, has turned into one of the 'little' clubs in their own City. As supporters of Aston Villa and for the odd Celtic fan that might be reading this, we wouldn't know what it is like to be the second club in our own City.
It must be hard for Mr Davies to accept and if Spurs continue their development under Twitcher, you never know, Arsenal could well become the third club in their City. That would be like supporting West Brom or Partick Thistle for people from Birmingham or Glasgow.
I like Alan Davies, he's a funny man, so this mention isn't for all of us to start having a pop at him, it was merely to show you that it isn't just the odd website, forum or blog that starts writing negative things about our club. Our very own local papers like to promote other negative things written about our club, even if said in jest.
Moving swiftly, from a comedian with questionable fashion sense, to James Milner. He won the award for man of the match against Burnley at the weekend. This could have gone to anyone as we were mostly awful, so well done James and let's try and forget about the football.
Actually, we can't. Yesterday saw an increased number of people offering up concerns over the quality of football getting served up to us as of late and there is also an increased annoyance of those that continue to defend the manager.
I'd just like to remind you that we are all entitled to an opinion. Some think he can do no wrong, some are convinced we're just replicating Leicester and some think it will get better with better players. I fall in the middle of tow of those so I can still be swayed but mostly because I want him to be successful.
We made 294 passes on Saturday and in that number I am including the failed ones. The four clubs above us were different; Chelsea (568), Manchester United (639), Arsenal (497) and Spurs (364). Now, Spurs are the closest to us but you'd have to be a very brave man to put money on them finishing fourth. I for one still think Liverpool will do it and they made 427 passes.
But, number of passes are just an indicator, however they are one that I like to look at so you get fed it too. If you've got others you'd like us to look at, request it below and I will. But for today, I'm hoping we get a little something from somewhere else because I fear it is going to be a quiet week otherwise.
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symbas
said:
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... Watchin Spurs bag a hatfull of goals spoils your argument i bit. Wish we could have a few more Boltons in the league.  |
Juan Pablo Angel
said:
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... Morning, Damien, I fail to see how we were 'taught a lesson by Burnley' and I really do question the relevance of this passing mumbo jumbo. You don't get points by passing, you get points by scoring goals. It is a part of the game and key to beautiful flowing football, but we aren't quite there yet and I for one would be quite happy with 6th this year. I think we'll finish higher, but there you have it. I know you wouldn't be happy and I understand you'd prefer to lose the manager because 'you don't think he will' (finish higher than sixth) before he does it and it is of course fair to judge people now on what might and hasn't happened. Not fair imo. Also Spurs played well yesterday agianst a Wigan team with some of the worst defending I have seen this season. We would have got a hatful against them yesterday too and while they are all well and good notching 9 in a game I would prefer to score one and concede none in the next nine games and stick 27 points on the board. We got a point at turf moor and BUrnley were very good. Not the end of the world. |
chrisb
said:
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... ALan davies is not funny. Just tweet him and say 'How come your not funny anymore?' That should destroy himm from within. |
VillaNick
said:
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... We were out-played against Bayern Munich in 1982 and then scoring off Peter Withe's Shin and off the post and in. We couldn't pass for toffee that season either  |
vivavilla
said:
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...Yesterday saw an increased number of people offering up concerns over the quality of football getting served up to us as of late and there is also an increased annoyance of those that continue to defend the manager. I've highlighted the key word. I wonder why it was yesterday this happened when we played on Saturday? |
Damian
said:
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... not really symbas and we can't really just look at one weekend. it has to be looked at over a period of time. if you look at the last five games for the perceived top four and us and spurs; this is it: chelsea: 2392 passes united: 2384 passes arsenal: 2337 passes liverpool: 2293 passes spurs: 1688 passes aston villa: 1467 passes |
Damian
said:
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... Juan Pablo Angel the relevance of the passing mumbo jumbo is as you've basically then gone on to explain it; the key to beautiful flowing football there is no surprise that other managers say we play long ball football or that pundits say we are one dimensional. look at the stats above just for the last 5 games but, as you say. we 'aren't quite there yet' but this is his 4th season and it isn't changing. if this was his 2nd, sure, give him the season and the next but this is his 4th season and it isn't changing fight and determination gets you so far and it will be exactly what you want, 6th. a question for you now; how many seasons are you going to be happy with 6th? |
VillaNick
said:
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... Maybe we could look at defensive blocks & Saves to get an indication how many opportunities the oppsoition are getting in front of our goal? |
Custard K3
said:
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... Maybe Johnathan Creek could work out whats wrong with our passing game Damian..... Like we really care what he thinks anyway!!!! |
Villa_Chris
said:
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... Boring boring boring. As you said Damian, 'Im hoping we'll get something from somewhere else'. Nan summed everything up in a paragraph yesterday when he got in there first. Its so predictable. Bring on Spurs! That will be an interesting game for us. But even then, either way the result goes, it will be the same old 'told you so' from whichever party. Football on the other hand is unpredictable. (As Dan pointed out in his post). Onwards & Upwards! |
davidc
said:
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... Its all about balance. And I think we've got it right on the whole. We're a good verging on very good mix currently. When we're on form, we're as exciting as anyone going forwards. We can beat anyone in this league. And its been years since we've been able to say that. Thats the big improvement (year on year improvement remember since MoN has been here) this year. This season we can (and have) beaten some of the 'big' 4. I'm looking forward to this weekend. I genuinely think we'll beat Spurs. I tell you one thing - if you offered Redknapp a point now, he'd bite your hand off. You should give us more credit that you do. We all should. The neutrals see us for what we are - perfectly capable, even the most likely to, break into the top 4 out of the 'pretenders'. |
eoin1981
said:
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... I am all for attractive passing football, a la Arsenal. But for me its not the be all and end all. At the end of the day - football is about creating chances and scoring goals whilst preventing the opposition doing it. The more chances you create as opposed to the opposition - the better you chances of winning games and finishing higher up the table. If villa score a goal via a punt up field, from a corner, from a penalty, from a bit of magic on the wing, or from a 273 pass move straight off the training ground - it really doesn't matter. But what I will say is that good movement and passing is the hardest to defend against and is without question the best way to break down teams who set out negative stalls - especially when they come to Villa park. Its not a coincidence that we continue to struggle against the supposedly 'weaker' teams and do well against the better ones. Its because we are limited tactically and want to play negatively ourselves! Another positive regarding 'posession' football - is that when its done correctly - you are in posession and have more players closer to the oppositions goal for more of the time. Being closer to the oppositions goal logically means - more shots, more chances, more corners, more crosses into the box and it indirectly means that if you are attacking then the opposition are defending and so wont be scoring! For over a year now - we have struggled to score and just as importantly (as its the reason) to create chances. For those residing on cloud cuckoo land who think we play attacking football(I think we have scored more than twice in a game three times this calendar year) - Damian could you possibly please provide the following stats: The amount of shots(either blocked, on target or off target or the three combined) for a few clubs(e.g Chelsea, Man City, Spurs, Everton, Ourselves and perhaps 1-2 crap teams like Bolton and Hull) for all the league games so far this season. I have a fair idea that its appalling from a villa perspective. |
Damian
said:
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... eoin1981 i will be able to provide that later ... have some manual labour in the garden to attend to first |
Villa_Chris
said:
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... James Milner “It wasn’t a day for pretty football, it was a day for getting second balls and flicking it on and keeping going and we managed to do that and get a point.” Interesting comment. Maybe this is the mentality going into games against 'lesser teams'? If so then we need more self belief. |
neil57
said:
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... This passing thing is soooooooo boring. Essien passes more than anyone else as he is in the middle and passes laterally loads. We get the ball forward ASAP. The PL is fast and furious. Wigan had a bad day at the office. Kirkland was quite good except for shots low from his left. Hiddink will replace Hughes. MON is safe as a row of houses. As I said in the last post, Pool would love him. As for Alan Davies, WTH, we know more about Football than he  Papers saying Anelka is more of a cheat than Henry, need to let it go. UTV |
davidc
said:
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... Essien is one of the best central midfielders in the world, let alone PL. His absence throughout last season was the single reason Chelsea didn't win the league (and/or EC). Saturday WAS a good point. The conditions were awful. Spurs and Arsenal would have come away from Turf Moor on Saturday with absolutely nothing. We need to move on. We need to stop doing this to ourselves. We are not going to win every game. We are not going to play scinitaliting football (like WBA did last season apparently. Or Arsenal do - and win nothing). Its good to be a Villa fan currently. These are the good times. If you cannot enjoy things as they are now, you really do need to get a new hobby. For the sake of your health and sanity. |
GGGG
said:
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... The passing stats aren't as important as the goals scored. Look at the scoring record of the current top four (and even Liverpool) and you can see why us and Man City (for all their millions & star strikers) are struggling to compete. Once Downing's up to speed our creativity should improve, but there's no killer instinct for goals in our side. A slight lack of confidence flagged up by missing penalties. Watching Tottenham yesterday, and Defoe in particular, showed what we're missing. Who'd you pick for England at the moment - Defoe, Crouch & Lennon or Gabby,Heskey & Young? (Bearing in mind you've got 3 games in which to score some goals at the World Cup else you're out.) I think the Burnley game was always going to be difficult. Only Chelsea, Man U & Arsenal are better at home this season, so a draw is a decent result. We didn't suddenly become superstars by thrashing Bolton! |
SidCowanslovechild
said:
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... Alan Davies is not and never has been funny Aston Villa and Celtic have both won the European Cup, Arsenal have not Who cares what that lisping effeminate t**t thinks anyway? Maybe me as I responded Villa are on a journey. We are doing well. We need better players to progress further and play differently. Whether we will get them I don't know but remain hopeful. We do (try) to play attacking football but it is not working for us at mo, this may or may not be due to a lack of quality but I certainly think we are missing creativity in central midfield/ link up/ 2nd striker. Stating the obvious I know but there you go |
Villa_Chris
said:
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... Patrick Berger played that creative CM role excellently before he was an idiot and got the sack. We need someone like that. Maybe Downing? Time will tell. |
djongrass
said:
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... Oh the irony. All the above is just bollocks! The question for today must surely be - "Why didn't we sign Jermaine Defoe (today's premier league top scorer) and the man with the killer finsh that we've all been desperate for when the window was open last summer? Don'tcha think? |
Glasgow Tom
said:
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... Nice comment about being the biggest club in your city _ although after my Celtic lost yesterday I am not sure whats we are Anyway Mr Davis like all Arsenal and to the same extent Chelsea fans need to be reminded that they have never won the greatest prize in Club Footbal The European Cup - now renamed the Champions League To be honest I am not sure I will see my club win it again - bt at least we have You are funny Mr Davies - Oh one last request when can we have Martin back because we really need him |
neil57
said:
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... I know Essien is brilliant. I meant that he controls the game slowly. We do not play that way, it is more direct. No doubt Essien would be on any team. How long has it taken Chelsea to get where they are now? Are their fans as fickle as some on this blog? One swallow doesn't make a summer. Spurs are not going to beat everyone. 1. Spurs would take a draw next week. 2. Most open PL ever, Chelsea lose some v good players in Jan. 3. Mourinho played winning, not pretty, football. The fans loved him. 4. The Chelsea manager has the worlds top players to choose from, imagine that pressure? It would be great to get to Wembley in Carling cup. You never know. You need luck, we had it there. UTV |
neil57
said:
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... See, even Celtic fans want him back WTF At least RL will give him more time than Roman |
SidCowanslovechild
said:
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... Djongrass, not sure it's that simple. Defoe's an excellent goalscorer but still needs chances to score. Also, pretty sure he would have preferred Spurs over Villa Not sure I see this irony you speak of or why everyone's comments except yours is boolox? |
flowershopboy
said:
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... I really think that when Downing is fully fit we will see a different style of play , hopefully with Downing Milner and young chopping and changing positions throughout the game will cut out the long ball game , at the moment we don't really have those options and the long ball is doing its job |
StickyAV
said:
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... As has always been the case (although with Chelsea this year winning ever game maybe not this time) if you draw your games away and win at home you win the league. A draw is ok in my view. I know Damian, you are desperate for us to play sweet passing footy, but we don't have the players. Look at our squad compared to those above us. We are 5th with a squad that on paper should be 7th behind the old top 4, spurs and city. We must be doing something right. If we won the league playing like this you wouldn't care. Like someone said above no one remembers in 82 we couldn't pass. We just remember the european cup, and we sing about it to any team who has never won it. Results people. A draw away aint bad. CHEER UP! |
StickyAV
said:
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... djongrass, defoe is a natural finisher. I'd love defoe. I'd love him in the squad. BUT, the reason he got 5 yesterday was because of THE MOST shocking defending I have ever seen by a premier league side, bar none. Shocking. Don't look too much in to those 5 goals. Good finishes yes, but give me 9 chances and i'll score 5 (defoe could have had at least 3/4 more). |
Villa_Chris
said:
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... Excuse me if Im being totally blind but this season I really don't think we are playing long ball. Why do people think we are? It occurs a lot less than last season. |
djongrass
said:
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... ...but we've all been clambering for a proven goalscorer and a creative midlfielder! Heskey isn't it and that's what we got! OK he scored a decent header at the weekend but Gaby's still, well Gabby and Carew is a 15+ per season striker at best! Where's the proven striker?? |
djongrass
said:
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... Looking at the top scorers so far this seasaon - Gabby is 8th with six and we have no-one else in the top 40 - THE TOP 40 - No-one! |
StickyAV
said:
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... GGGGG, Man City are leaking goals. Thet attack very very well, but let the same number of goals in. We don't score goals, but don't let many in. It hink there is a big difference between the teams, you can't look at goal difference as a real indicator... |
ak_27
said:
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... Anyone who just discounts possession and the need to be comfortable on the ball as a luxury are just kidding themselves. Maybe you start watching more games then just Villa games. It is not a luxury it is a necessity for any club looking to break into the top 4. Do you think it is just a coincidence that the top teams stst are normally 2/3 times higher with regards to passes completed? Why do you think come Feb our players are normally dead on their legs? Could it be to do with the fact that they have more milage on their clocks at that point then anyone else due to lack of rotation and also due to possession stats (you lose expend far more inj without the ball then you do when your have it). Look aroung Europe and look at the CL and you will see not too many teams play our style and are successful. The sad thing is even if we did ever get to CL under MON and this style of football we would be shown up badly in Europe as we already have been by micky mouse teams over the last 2 seasons. And before people say about it will take better players coming in to improve the passing these players would have to improve the passing inspite of MON not because of MON. He should also be a coach and if he can't he should have coaches of the quality to instill this skill in players. But as far as i can see we have old fashioned coaches (who played the game 30 years ago) being lead by and old fashioned manager. There are underlying issues with this club and the football is mirroring this. |
ak_27
said:
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... The basic logic to the possession game is control. Are you in control of the ball if you knock it 60 yards in the air to where you have 1 player and they have 1 player? No. You are only playing the % game and you are HOPING for the ball to bounce your way. You are relying on LUCK instead of being in control of the ball and untimately your own destiny. That is the sign of a poor team to me and untiamtely a poor manager especially at a club who has spent 130m. |
Damian
said:
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... celtic would have strachan back at the moment - that isn't saying much for o'neill didn't we have a deal for defoe almost done before he went to pompey? i seem to remember it was a case of we wouldn't offer him what he wanted |
SidCowanslovechild
said:
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... Djongrass, I still think it is at least as much the creative side of our play which is below par as the strikers. We are not getting any goals from central midfield and only sporadic from wings. However we are at a point where only very good players will make much of a difference to our 1st team. Most of the transfer targets suggested are either unrealistic or won't improve our 1st team, we do not need a bunch more squad fillers. Whether we can yet attract these types of player I don't know |
ak_27
said:
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... Damien we had Defoe and Diarra at VP both wanting to sign but all we got was Routledge. |
Richard79
said:
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... Tell Davies to count his team's European Cups before he come out with a daft remark like that. Both Celtic and Villa have their names on that trophy so it is immortal. Celtic are in a mess right now thanks to poor leadership and a lack of investment in the team. Villa are doing ok from what I can see so on both clubs wait and see. |
SidCowanslovechild
said:
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... AK, is that right we had Defoe at VP wanting to sign? Missed chance if that is right |
ak_27
said:
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... Sid we had him in the office before he joined Pompy. He would have joined but i suspect MON would pay the going rate in wages. Same for Diarra. Both would have joined us before Pompy if we had offered what they wanted in wages and before people say look at Pompy now Villa are a far bigger club and if we can't pay guys like this the wages required then forget about ever being a top club again. At that time we were actually only a few points behind liverpool who were in 4th and all we brought in was Routlegde. That was when i first really decided that MON isn't the man for this club. You don't get 2 players of that quality wanting to join too often and to not have the balls(or vision) to make it happen then where are we going? |
djongrass
said:
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... Defoe would have shined at VP, Heskey wouldn't be here and Gabby would've been fighting for a place in the team - which is exactly what he needs! Defoe - We didn't have the minerals to sign him and lost out on todays' premier league top scorer. |
villarobin
said:
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... I cant see anyone going to Burnley in the howling wind and rain and playing Flowing / Passing football !! If you do you will get beaten, like Arsenal at the weekend. Simples. Having said this, it would be nice if we could play abit more flowing football WHEN and ONLY WHEN it is relevant. |
mikey18
said:
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... Diarra would of been a bad signing. Arsenal best passing team in the league haven't won anything in four years. Alonso one of the best passers of the ball in the world, liverpool still didn't win the league. Mourhino known for ugly play and unattractive football, retained the title in his first two years in english football. Won the serie A with inter in his first year there. Martinez praised for his passing game, especially after he beat us 1st game of the season, gone tits up no hasn't it. Tony mowbray another manager known for his passing game, didn't work for WBA not working for celtic. Everton the only team to break the top 4, Bolton under sam alladyce, middlesborough under mcclaren all not known for a great passing game. They played to their strengths and were successful. We haven't got the played of the top 4 or even spurs (huddlestones one of the best technicians on the ball in the world) Sidwell and petrov just aren't a good enough midfield for us to play keep ball. So we play to our strengths which is wing play, which involves less passes. |
ak_27
said:
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... villarobin if Burnley can get it down and pass it in the howling wind then why can't we? Do we not have better players in every position on the pitch? Why then do our players often look like the team that just been promoted with regards to playing it on the floor? To me that is a coaching issue not a personnel issue. |
James Collins is the ginger Paolo Cesare Maldini
said:
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... Milner MOTM?!?!? Blokes a poor player and very overrated. Never thought we'd find a player slower than Barry but we've found him!! |
villarobin
said:
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... ak27 we played passing football last week and won 5.1 Man Utd lst at Burnley, we drew. It is possible for Villa to draw and loose games |
villarobin
said:
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... saturday was a game for getting stuck in, not passing like arsenal. passing like arsenal isnt our style anyway. we have our own style. sometimes it works , sometimes it doesnt. be good to have another style of play , I agree, but things really are'nt that bad. we can be v exciting at times. I would sooner we stutter now , and still be sniffing around the top 4 , and then it all comes good next year after xmas |
keithj
said:
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... the reason our pass rate is low is obvious,if te long ball to ash, milner or carew is defended then our midfield is never there to contend the defended ball, that is our midfielders are defending. i can only remember a couple of exceptions one being the petrov shot against wolves. damian, i still believe top 4 so would you like some sugar sent for that meal |
tubbydunne
said:
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... Spot on Mikey 18. You choose your style of play to best suit the players at your disposal. There's no point attempting to play attractive passing football if you haven't got the players to do it. W.B.A. passed their way to the championship. M.O.N. is constantly improving the squad and he is well aware the engine room needs an overhaul. Downing is now fit and it looks like Reo is on the way out, his replacement will be interesting. Very happy with the way the club is going and would be glad to see us playing a passing game in the future as it would mean we have the players to do it. |
ak_27
said:
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... mikey18 its amazing in your list there you forgot to include Man utd champions of England and CL winners 2 years ago and also Barca champions of Europe and of Spain. |
frosty
said:
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... I didn't realise Moore had become this shi*te .. http://www.footballtransfertav...r+Tavern+ Home+Page) Defoe - I struggle to believe that, MON pays over the odds when he has to, I think no matter what we offered ( if anything) Redknapp would of upped it knowing that he was going to ruin Pompey and take him back to Spurs anyway. Also lets not forget he can't cut it on the world stage, rose tinted glasses today imo. |
ak_27
said:
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... Chris just out of curiosity what would it take from Villa this season for you to start having major doubts over O'Neill? |
villarobin
said:
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... ak27, im sorry but you cannot have 'serious doubts' about your manager when you are in the top 4 / 5 of the premier league, unless you are used to winning it.. |
villarobin
said:
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... its like people who slag the england manager off when we get to the quarter finals and then loose on penalties. Hold on a minute its the quarter finals of the world cup, we have done damn well to get there and then penalties are a lottery. |
croni
said:
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... jesus christ, it was was only the game before that we won 5-1 burnley have a great home record, it was a tough match and an important draw, and a precious point that will be very useful come the end of the season having major doubts about O'neill displays a real sense of impatience, immaturity and an ignorance about the complexities of our style of play, which is a lot more than simply hoofing the ball up the field and playing with heart. idiots |
villarobin
said:
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... Oneil needs at least this season and another 2 because there is no quick fix unless you have treble the money to spend that we have. I get frustrated by his substitutions / style of play as well at times, but you would get this with any manager. |
Juan Pablo Angel
said:
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... Damien, Arsene Wenger has been at Arsenal for 13 years and groomed that squad from kids to what they are now. In his 4th season they may have been a successful side by then, but it was based around cast offs and unknowns and a large amount of the players he inherited i.e the defence and Bergkamp. Ferguson won nothing at Man U for his first four years and was almost let go before he landed the league cup. Chelsea have had three managers since Mourinho and I don't believe this has done them any good, and despite Mourinho being a great manager I think given that existing team and then the funds he had available MoN could have landed the title there. Rafa has signed player after player that wasn't good enough and has survived on his tactics in the CL to see him through. If he hadn't flukily landed the CL title in his first season he wouldn't be there now. There is a lot to be said in favour of continuity at club level and the manager of our club is not the problem. We are getting better. On paper this is probably the best squad we've had since the early-mid nineties and that is because MoN has gone out and assembled it. We have players in the squad who can do the passing thing and after the way we improved after Downing's introduction on sat I think we are going to be fine. The players are there now and I'm happy to give MoN plenty more time to get them playing the kind of football we want to see. Passing aside the guy does know how to win football matches. We struggled so much in his first year but he has continued to add quality player after quality player, instilled a fight and determination we haven't had for years and we are now able to beat the best teams in europe. If we can just hold the ball a little more and play a few more passes around the opposition box we'll get back on the goal trail. Why take such drastic action if the problem is such a slight one. I think the unrest arises due to the fact we are so close to being a really good side. Just remember who got us here and not bite the hand that feeds us. It would absolutely disgusting if MoN went after everything brilliant he has done. Just look at the way Darren Ferguson was forced out of Posh. Two promotions in two years and the most success the club has ever had!! not enough points after 17 games sorry you're sacked. Disgusting. If we were languishing around the bottom of the table then fine but we are fifth and we can stick ourselves in the semis of a cup and pull level with spurs inside the next week. Not exactly panic stations is it you ungrateful lot. |
villarobin
said:
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... Look at the Arsenal fans , or some of them last year calling for Wengers head when we were above them and their 'Style Of Play' wasnt working. People have no patience these days. Ok if after 6 or so seasons Oneil is stagnating then look for a change, but to change before that is utterly pointless, especially when you are challenging at the high end of the table. |
Villa_Chris
said:
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... Good question... I think if we finish outside top 7. Obviously the top 4 are strong teams, then its a fight between ourselves, Spurs, Man City and probably Everton. But then again, it will be the manner in which we lose out on a high finish which will make my mind up whether MON is the man for next season. Listen, I know things aren't going how we all would like, but I think judging this early on is pointless. I say give it until easter and see how things are going. I think the return of Downing will change the structure of the team, therefore the style of play. I understand that yourself and others, including Damian, are fed up with Villa not playing silky football but lets see what happens from now until the end of the season. I believe we can turn it around. What I would really love to see is more substitutes used, earlier on in games when things aren't going well. For instance, Carew should have been taken off early 2nd half on Saturday because he was non-exsistant. This is my gripe with MON. I hope he drops Sidwell too. |
eoin1981
said:
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... It seems to me that if we finish 6th again this season, 90% of people on here will be delighted. This despite the fact that it will mean that City and Spurs have passed us out and once again we will have missed out on one of the top 4 having a shocking season by their standards. I dont see the progress, I dont see how MoN can break the top 4, i dont see him learning from his mistakes (playing the same 11 week in - week out, anyone remember last season??), and I dont see Stuart Downing (good player and all that he is) as being the messiah. I am sorry but playing Milner or Downing in the middle is not going to change our style of play in the slightest. All it'll mean is Sidwell goes to right back. |
kingfisher villa
said:
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... just been on the NEW villa website and the lastest news is from the 20.11.09!! what a joke  |
vivavilla
said:
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... I actually agree with Villa_Chris regarding the long ball situation. We certainly see less of it than we used to. |
Juan Pablo Angel
said:
|
... eoin This despite the fact that it will mean that City and Spurs have passed us out and once again we will have missed out on one of the top 4 We passed spurs last season. Just because we finished 6th last season does not mean we will this year and if we finish 6th this season there is always next! Spurs had a bigger better squad that was underperforming when Redknapp went there. Given the players Ramos signed they should have been vying for the CL last year but it all backfired. He's made a couple of astute signings and turned their fortunes around. Man City have spent hundreds of millions. MoN has rebuilt the entire squad and done it in a gradual fairly cost effective manner. and I dont see Stuart Downing (good player and all that he is) as being the messiah. I am sorry but playing Milner or Downing in the middle is not going to change our style of play in the slightest Oh yeah, no point in even trying it then. May as well sell all of them yeah? dont see the progress, I dont see how MoN can break the top 4, i dont see him learning from his mistakes (playing the same 11 week in - week out, anyone remember last season??), We had a smaller squad last season, and we are already seeing the benefits of having a larger one. We lost our captain and one of our best players out for Bolton and p**sed it 5-1. Not bad imo. Like i said above, judge at the end of the season. Even better judge at the end of next season, i'm sure Randy and MoN are keen on doing things based on what you think is going to happen. Eoin is your real name Meg? |
ak_27
said:
|
... Here is my prediction for the remainder of the season (unless Downing has a major effect on the team) is that we will continue to graft out some great results againest top teams but drop poor points againest weak oppossition. This will continue until mid Jan when due to MON's policy of long ball coupled with his idiotic approach to subs and squad rotation this team will be dead on its feet come the business end of the season. He will then bring out the same excuses as he has done over the last few years about tirness even though he is untimatley to blame for this himself. For a so called intelligent manager he really doesn't seem to learn from his own mistakes. Villarobin that is why i have my serious doubts about the man as this is what i see down the line. Only time will tell but the evidence and our track record points to this conclusion im affraid. But no way should MON be given another 3 years if we have a bad season this time around. The further down a wrong road you go the further back you have to come to try and build again. The man has shown how stubborn he is and he is not the type to change so if he fails he will only continue down the same unsuccessful route if it turns out to be not working. |
Villa_Chris
said:
|
... ak_27 As you said yourself, 'only time will tell'. So why do you constantly post posts from a negative viewpoint, regarding what will happen in the future? |
Juan Pablo Angel
said:
|
... ak, He doesn't make the same mistakes. We needed more quality, money off the wage bill and some pace and presence so he let a lot of the not so good and older players leave and brought in a brilliant Cm who is now captain, a Striker who is arguably world class and one of the brightest british prospects with loads of pace. We were lacking in CM so he moves an underachieving LB there and turns him into a world beater. We are scoring loads of goals but conceding loads so he signs an entirely new defence which pushes us into being on of the toughest to score against in the berst league in europe. We had a small squad and suffered from fatigue so he went out and has vaslty improved the squad resulting in two options in every position on the field. Now that this is sorted it has become apparent that a more creative influence is needed in CM after one of the better players we've had turned his back on the club. Why wouldn't he sort this too? He has sorted out everything else out you lot have been moanning about. Give him a bloddy chance, he's only been here three years and he's completely overhauled the entire squad you ungrateful git. |
Villa_Chris
said:
|
... And to be fair to MON, he has made it pretty clear in the press of late that we have a bigger squad this season, and that he will need to use it to stop us getting burnt out. He's even mentioned Salifou!! Where's Chiefy?  |
Geoff
said:
 |
... That is SUCH a meaningless statistic. Being American some of my fellow baseball fans tend to do this with a worthless baseball statistic too - as somehow its an indicator of something. They are NOT an average team. In the Premiership, Stoke City is an average team. Villa are well above average, and I think thats fairly obvoius. But you cant just waltz into some teams ground and expect them to lay down to you just because they were in the Championsip last year. This is the best league in the world, and its that way for a reason. That said, they certainly need to make some upgrades in January to add a difference maker or two and then maybe more depth. It sounds like they will sign Micah Richards if he leaves City. Fine, but thats a depth move until Richards has a solid first team place here. |
Juan Pablo Angel
said:
|
... Here is my prediction for the remainder of the season Downing has a huge effect on the team and we start playing more attractive football and manage to win the odd game we may have drawn before. We don't go on a huge unbeaten run like last year, but we don't go on the bad run after jan either and consistently pick up points. Because we have a larger squad MoN starts rotating and resting players and changing things around so players have more in the tank at the business end of the season and we win the Carlign Cup. Despite the success and a top 4 finish the fans on this blog start calling for his head as we didn't string together 7,864000 passes during the season despite our first silverware in over ten years. For a so called intelligent manager he really does seem to learn from his own mistakes but the fans on this blog won't leave him alone. Judge on results not on what you think will happen. |
Juan Pablo Angel
said:
|
...He's even mentioned Salifou!! Where's Chiefy? Where is chiefy? Emule scored at the weekend, maybe he died celebrating? |
Craigy1874
said:
 |
... Juan Pablo Angel - spot on mate, if only everyone was so level headed us villa fans wouldnt have such a bad name. |
eoin1981
said:
|
... Juan Pablo Angel - first off Meg is merely my middle name. I agree completely that Redknapp inherited a team that was massively underperforming. I would also say that MoN inherited a team that just one season previously had finished 6th - so maybe he didn't quite have to raise the club from the dead, as his 'messiah' status would have us believe. Villa have been 'best of the rest' as in the non-contenders for practically the last 18 years - with just a few years of deviations. So when exactly are we to stop thinking about next season? Man City are passing us out, and next season - there will be another club with a billionaire - are we going to say thats just fine and dandy again? Should we just accept 6th to 8th as the pinnacle? I didn't mean to slag off Downing and in fact I said he was a good player. I just dont see either him or Milner being the central midfielder that we need. Of course they are worth a try but frankly a cardboard cutout of Sidwell would be better than Sidwell himself. There is a reason why both of them have played the majority of their careers on the wing. Neither of them are prolific - in fact I think Downing didn't score in the entire of last season. And finally if we had Xavi or Fabregas in midfield I dont think it would change the way we play. This comes from the coach and 11 players who are comfortable on the ball, have an idea or gameplan and who know how to make space - i dont think we have many in the squad - with the exceptions of Warnock and possibly Delph. |
ak_27
said:
|
... First off i believe my view point to be realistic not negative. Chris i really hate and disagree with the direction the club is going under MON. I can't help it but i seriously dislike the man and the way he views the game. I honestly belive that he is holding us back not making us great again as many see him. What annoys me is the amount of credit he gets for doing the minimum required. For eg people priase him for getting the sqaud numbers up? Wow. What a genius for a manager to have enough players to play for the club. The thing is Chris too many see this man as a saviour and totaly discount the 130m that has been pumped into the club which is in my mind glossing over his flaws. He is not a manager for a big club. He is a manager for a small club who want to over achieve. he would be a great man for Bolton but not for Villa. The last 2/3 months i have started to not be bothered about watching Villa games for the first time since i have been a fan. Why? Its nothing to do with my interest in the sport but i just can't stand the way we play. I detest it and i do not look forward to watching it anymore. |
ak_27
said:
|
... JPA you just prove what im saying about giving MON prasie for nothing. Just so you know Barry was already playing midfield for Villa when MON took charge. Gabby = World class? Really. If he is what you classify as world class then i don't hink we can really discuss football and ever agree. Whats the point of a squad if you don't use it? I guarintee you they will be fatiqued come the end of Jan. Sqquad size only matters if you utilise it. |
Geoff
said:
|
... Are you freaking kidding me? This guy has built a good, strong nucleus at Villa. Theres some garbage players, a few bad signings. But every other team ahs garbage signings that dont pan out too, even the big clubs. Except when Chelsea does it they spend 40M on the guy and he sits on the bench and only gets to play against bad teams and in lesser cup ties. After two seasons of it the player cant take it anymore and leaves for first team football somewhere else....the guys that sit the bench on this team - with a few exceptions - BELONG on the bench. Not to say that they totally suck, but they are not starters. Now, if they could get some depth and quality so that you have quality players battling each other for a spot in the lineup every week AND if they can get someone in there better than Sidwell and Delph (Delph needs a few seasons to develop fully) then they will have more staying power in the uppoer portion og the league. |
SidCowanslovechild
said:
|
... Everyone thinks they are the realist and everyone else an idiot Ak knows his football, I disagree with his interpretation often but that's ok, different opinions should be encouraged I would rather people came out and criticised directly than hiding and having little digs as some do From a personal perspective, I can see some flaws in the way we play football but that we are making progress as well. Unfortunately the progress this season has been more about defence which is not as exciting as silky midfield passes or clinical finishing. We are still evolving and think there is a good chance we will become a really good team under MON but we need a better central midfield and ideally a 20 goal a season finisher, hard to find but this is all outstanding from us having a really good team in my opinion |
villa@herts
said:
 |
... JPA: I totally agree with you although I believe we do have some real quality among some of the youngsters including Delph. I don’t buy the he is still too young or inexperienced he could be just the creative midfield player we needs. I also think that Gabby has not improved and has adopted both Carew and Heskey's lazy attitude. I am also sorry to say that I think Ashley has also stopped trying and is not the exciting prospect he was last year. I would bring in the Fonze to replace Gabby and Albrighton to replace Ashley. Move Milner to the centre and Downing on the wing and we would have an impressive team that could beat a Spuds team that is good going forward but lacking in defence. We have a better defence but dont have the killer finish that they do - but with some changes we could have. This is my first post for some time I got fed up with all the negative posts I am sorry to say nothing has changed. I was at Burnley and although were not good the conditions were so bad that go0od flowing football was never going to happen. Although I was pleased to see Downing, I was sorry to see NRC was missing Sidwell has no place in the starting line-up. |
Villain-from-Texas
said:
 |
... I'm truly shocked that people continue to moan about MON. Guys, we're in a pretty good spot right now. So we've dropped some points we all would've wanted to earn, but we're in the mix at the moment. The lineup I would love to see: ------------Big Bad-------------- Young---Collins---Dunne---Warnock ------------Petrov--------------- -----Reo-----------------Delph--- Young--------Milner-------Downing -------------Gabby--------------- |
villa@herts
said:
|
... Villain-from-Texas: I would love the team too but not sure FA would go with the etra player!! |
ak_27
said:
|
... Villain-from-Texas that would be the strongest team Villa would have put out for many a year. I would love to see it also but i doubt it would be allowed. |
villarobin
said:
|
... ak 27, What do you mean "If we have another bad season" !!! ??? We havent had a "Bad" season yet under Oneil. Yes he should be given another 2 seasons after this at least.. We are not doing "Badly" at the moment !! Are you and some of the others looking at a different league table or something !! |
villa@herts
said:
|
... How about: ---Little or Big Brad--- Young---Collins---Dunne---Warnock --Petrov or NRC-- Albrighton--------Milner-------Downing -Delph- -Delfouneso- If you think this is too radical for Spuds game it could be tried against Portsmouth in the L-cup game? IMO Fonze is a a more natural goal scorer than any other options and Albrighton is both a better crosser of the ball and attacking winger than Ash (on his current form.) Just a thought UTV |
SidCowanslovechild
said:
|
... Ak, isn't this a less attacking version of the 4-4-4 formation you were suggesting recently? |
GGGG
said:
|
... StickyAV said Man City are leaking goals. Thet attack very very well, but let the same number of goals in. I wasn't talking about goal difference, I was talking about goals scored! |
Doc Bowles
said:
 |
... I wonder how many of us wouldn't right now take an industrious, hard-fought spirited 1-0 win over Spurs on Saturday, with a scrappy goal from a long ball bagging the three points. I would. |
ak_27
said:
|
...What do you mean "If we have another bad season" !!! ??? We havent had a "Bad" season yet under Oneil. Yes he should be given another 2 seasons after this at least.. Where above did i actually say another bad season? If you are going to quote someone do it correctly and don't add in key words. (unless i said it somewhere else and can't see it ). |
ronrabbit
said:
 |
... Can everyone remember this time last year when we all looked at lennon and slated him pointing out that he was no where near as techincally gifted as our ashley. You no i dont think that has changed, i think young is technically better, which in my mind shows you how much difference attitude makes. We all harp on about o'neill getting the best out of players, he isnt gettign the best out of ashley young. I dont even think he is getting the best out of gabby, who i think could be awsome, if he didnt spend all game chasing crappy long balls into the courners. I think o'neills long ball tactics are starting to shine through in our best players, i their creative edge is being ebbed away and replaced with a hoof it up the pitch mentality. I think watching spurs yesturday drove something home to me, they have peter crouch, tallest player in the league? How many long balls did they hit to him? How many balls into the courner did defoe have to chase. They play a very similar formation and system to us, they have similar players, very similar, yet they play flowing attacking football, we bang it up the pitch for carew to head down. spurs comparison: gomes, friedal young, assou akotto dunne, woodgate cuellar, bassong warnock, dawson krankjar, milner lennon, young palacious, sidwell (should be reo coker 100% of the time) huddelstone, petrov defoe, gabby carew, crouch all the midfielders and attackers are similar players, with similar abilitys, some you would give to spurs, (palacious) some to us (milner). I think our defence is far superiour, but seriosly the only difference can be system, and management, and im afrad to say it but if you want to see flowing attacking football then good old arry is your man, if you want long balls into the courner then, take it away mr o'neill. |
villarobin
said:
|
... ak 27 This is exactly what you said, if you want to be pedantic: "But no way should MON be given another 3 years if we have a bad season this time around. The further down a wrong road you go the further back you have to come to try and build again" This is basically saying that 6th is a bad season, its not incredible no, but it certainly isnt Bad either ! Also , how is challenging the top 4 on a regular basis going "To far down the wrong road" Garbage mate, garbage.. |
ronrabbit
said:
|
... Ak: The last 2/3 months i have started to not be bothered about watching Villa games for the first time since i have been a fan. Why? Its nothing to do with my interest in the sport but i just can't stand the way we play. I detest it and i do not look forward to watching it anymore. I completly agree, i go the games, because well thats what i do, im a villa fan and im stuck with it, and will be for the rest of my life, ill continue to go to villa park and watch crap football, sing about john carew, but i dont go because i want to anymore, i go because its in the blood. people go to church not because they want to, but because that is there religion, aston villa is my religion, and im stuck with it. But as i say i dont enjoy watching the games, i enjoy the feeling of winning, but as for entertainment, well i could always paint the spare room every saturday and watch it dry for two hours. |
GGGG
said:
|
... ronrabbit said palacious, sidwell (should be reo coker 100% of the time) Definitely agree with you there - Sidwell's been given long enough and hasn't produced the goods. He looked a great prospect at Reading but for whatever reason, he just isn't doing it at Villa. NRC makes us look much more solid. |
vivavilla
said:
|
... ronrabbit, not the best comparison as Assou-Ekotto is a left back and Dawson is a centre back. I see what you're saying though, and I'd take all of our defenders apart from maybe a 100% Woodgate. Midfield though, Spurs batter us I'm afraid. Kranjcar, Modric, Palacios, Lennon would all walk into our starting XI as far as I'm concerned. Young may be technically better than Lennon, but Lennon is on fire at the moment and is responsible for a lot of goals - something Young isn't. The only Villa player who would threaten a fully-fit Spurs side is Petrov over Huddlestone. |
ronrabbit
said:
|
... Also , how is challenging the top 4 on a regular basis going "To far down the wrong road" was finishing 10 points behind arsenal really pushing them to their limits? Because what it suugests to me, and correct me if im wrong, but arsenal had 4th spot sown up with atleast 3 games to go. That is not challenging, thats being an also ran. |
villarobin
said:
|
... Ron Rabbit, so you prefered watching Gavin Mcann and Baros then did you ?? I suppose you were bored *hitless when we put 5 passed Bolton last week. I suppose your bored watching Ashley or Gabby when they are on fire, or bored watching a really solid defence. Christ almighty I can now understand why my scouse mates think Brummies are whinging , wining people. Im absolutely gobsmacked, i really am.. |
ak_27
said:
|
... villarobin if you put my words into a quote you should put in exactly what i said. You claimed i had said 'another' bad season when i didn't say that at all and you made an issue of that statement even though i hadn't said it at all. No big deal. |
Keithc
said:
 |
... Eoin, MON inherited a team that had finished 6th TWO seasons prior. The finished 10th in the 04-05 campaign and 16th the season prior to MON joining. It was a team rapidly on the decline. |
ronrabbit
said:
|
... They were the two teams this weekend that i compared, that is what i was looking it, modric didnt play, and dawson played full back this weekend. id take warnock, woodgate, dunne, young milner, palacious, petrov, lennon crouch/carew, defoe cant make my mind up between crouch and carew, for me carew would edge it, but im probably bias. I think milner offers more than krankjar, who i have never been a massive fan of, alot of the places are close, this is my point, the difference between the teams is tactics and style of play, where spurs are out in front by miles. |
ronrabbit
said:
|
... when was the last time gabby and young were on fire? gabby had a good game against chelsea. that is it. Also scoring 5 goals does not mean we played attacking flowing football. Hull scored 3 this weekend, does that mean they are a brilliant attacking threat? just because we scored five does not mean the football was good. Also no i didnt prefer baros and mccann, but thats not the point, its the style of football, not the players, messi, kaka, ronaldo, eto, would all play dull football under o'neill because he would still insist on having a big man up top to bang it up to, thats his style and it will never change. Also there is a difference between being bored, and the fooball not being entertaining, your not bored because of the passion, not the entertainment. |
Badger
said:
 |
...From a personal perspective, I can see some flaws in the way we play football but that we are making progress as well. This is my standpoint too. Even though you wouldn't think it of late, I'm still pretty positive on the whole. The squad is miles better now than it has ever been, imo. But I have to side with AK on this one. What's the point when you don't use it? While I'm not mad on possession statistics, it is a fair point that our players are going to be burnt out quicker. And while MON might say he'll rotate, we haven't seen much sign of it have we? What's he going to do, wait until players are burnt out before rotating them? But then, I don't want to come across as too pessimistic. I do have concerns about the way we play, but at the end of the day, you can't knock our current position. I actually think we'll beat Spurs and that would leave us very well placed. As for wanting MON out, no way. We're stable and he has to be given more time, at least this season and probably next too. I think his work in the transfer window was excellent and if he can do the same in the summer, we'll have a really good side. But this part is crucial and it's where we'll see if MON is a good manager or not. As has been said, no more squad level players, they have to be top notch. And that is the part that worries me. Again, as has been said, time will tell. |
Villa_Chris
said:
|
...This is exactly what you said, if you want to be pedantic: Hey!! Thats my role on the blog! Ask Pancho! |
ronrabbit
said:
|
... Can i calrify im not suggesting we sack o'neill, i would rather win playing crap football, than lose in style. Besides who could we relpace him with? (other than gus hiddink who doesnt have a job anymore). i just think we have the players to play some decent football now, and wish we could just get it on the ground and pass it around. |
vivavilla
said:
|
... ronrabbit Gabby's been playing very well all season. His contributions have been absolutely massive in a lot of games - he works his socks off playing a combination of striker/winger/occasional midfielder. Literally the only thing missing from Gabby's game, the thing that's holding him back from becoming a complete striker, is the ability to finish. Especially from one-on-one situations, something he's piss poor at right now. |
Villa_Chris
said:
|
... To be fair Viva, he did well when he raced through against Burnley. It was a good save from 'The Beast'. |
villarobin
said:
|
... Exactly Keith C, when Oneil took over we were on a rapid decline and the team was awful. I remember going to Highbury and seeing us get slapped 5 nil in one of O'learys last games. I went to Highbury last year , and saw Villa play one of the best games ive ever seen them play, Arsenal could hardly take the ball from us. Then you get idiots on this site saying we have'nt improved !! Whinge whinge whinge !! For gods sake why dont you whinge when there is good reason to whinge, like when we are hopeless and sliding towards relegation with no money for players. Or may be when we loose 3 on the trot. ! |
BobbyPark
said:
 |
... ak_27 you talk more sense than anyone on this site, you are dead right to have reservations about MON. One thing that should have been adressed a long time ago by our manager is the inability of our team to perform in the first half away from home, with the exception of Anfield we haven't turned up for the first 45 minutes in any away game since Arsenal. Is this because the team bus stops for a pub lunch and piss up on the way to the game, or maybe 'cos MON is Mr Negative i.e. keep it tight, don't take any risks, and catch them on the break. The half time can of red bull and line of speed sometimes does the trick but often its to late and we end up scrapping for a draw. It's piss poor really and that's why we'll finish 7th or 8th. |
ak_27
said:
|
... Ron for me Hiddink would make us a force again if did manage to get him. I would fear for us if City or Liverpool get him but i do think he would come if we paid him massive wages. But i also think MON should have until the end of this season to prove the likes of myself completely wrong. Saying that i don't think Learner knows enough about the game to see that making the likes of Hiddink our manager would be the start of something special for this club. He is a top notch coach. I think Leaner may be under MON's spell too much. |
ronrabbit
said:
|
... vivavilla hes played ok, he was brilliant agaist chelsea, he looked on a par with drogba that game. i know players have good days and bad days, and this was a very good day, but there is more from him, i maintain that its the system that holds him back. he is alwasy at his best when he is up on his own, because when we play 442 we constantly knock balls into the courner for him to chase, which consistanly come to nothing. |
ak_27
said:
|
... villarobin so you think that you can over look the 130m spent and then compare this team to DOL's team and to justify MON 'brialliant' job since he took over? Seriously there aren't too many managers in our league if they had that money to spend wouldn't have us where we are today. £130m is a lot of money. |
ronrabbit
said:
|
... I remember going to Highbury and seeing us get slapped 5 nil in one of O'learys last games I remember going to anfield last year, sitting in with the liverpool fans, next to the mrs's brother and dad and seeing us get spanked 5 nil. |
Villain-from-Texas
said:
|
... villa@herts:
We need the extra midfielder. No one will notice. They didn't even notice Henry's handball. |
davidc
said:
|
... I remember going to Turf Moor and seeing us getting spanked under O'Leary too. Things are good under MON. And they are going to get better. Believe it. |
villarobin
said:
|
... AK27 Yes hes spent 130 mil and that has got us to around 6th / 5th pushing for 4th. Look at what Chelsea and Man City will spend to get 4th and above. In this league in this day and age £130 mil will get you exactly where it has got us. So again, Oneil has done well with that money. |
villa@herts
said:
|
... Villain-from-Texas That was France. They may even let Man U or Chelsea or Arse get away but not the Villa or am I just Cynical!! |
VillaNick
said:
|
... I see Wigan fans are getting a refund for the 9-1 loss to Spurs. Any chance of a refund for the Burnley draw?  |
Keithc
said:
|
... Eoin, here's the team that O'Leary started his last season with: Sorensen, Hughes, Mellberg, Laursen, Samuel, Solano, Davis, McCann, Barry, Angel, Phillips. Subs from: Taylor, Hendrie, Djemba-Djemba, Ridgewell, Moore. I'd say there are only three players we'd want back from that side; one retired, and one will next year. That's quite a cleanup job, and one that's had the team improving year-on-year. Now let's compare to, say, Tottenham Hotspur, since that's the team everyone's obsessed about now that they put up 9. Here's what 'Arry inherited: Tottenham: Gomes, Corluka, Woodgate, Dawson, Bale, Lennon, Zokora, Huddlestone, Modric, Pavlyuchenko, Bent. Subs From: Cesar, Gilberto, Campbell, O'Hara, Giovani, Jenas, Bentley That looks pretty familiar for a Tottenham supporter, no? And when you factor in that two of Harry's buys included undoing mistakes that Ramos made the previous summer (selling Defoe and Keane), and that Redknapp has done the same thing that O'Neill's been slated for on here (buying old players- see Kranjcar, Defoe, Crouch), seems like 'Arry's done less than O'Neill's had to do, no? Furthermore, when you look at the state Portsmouth has been in since Redknapp's departure, I don't envy Spurs their early-season success. I'm much happier with MON, thanks. |
GGGG
said:
|
... I don't understand the disappointment at the Burnley result. They've won more games at home than us, Man City or Liverpool and we're only the 2nd side not to lose there this season. People seem to think they should be a pushover just because they don't serve prawn sandwiches... |
vivavilla
said:
|
... I don't think there's a single player from that O'Leary side I'd want back. Barry might make us a slightly better team, but I still wouldn't have him back. |
neil57
said:
|
... AK27, you are clinically depressed MON has had to totally rebuild the team. Spurs has more money than we have. Marketing must be improved to raise finances. Liverpool was in a good way when RAFA took over. He has still spent an awful amount of money. MON now has a very enviable defence. Try not to be so negative. Villarobin and JPA well done. UTV |
ak_27
said:
|
... Give me Salano over Milner or Young any day of the week. He is exactly what we we lack in the team right now. Quality footballer. |
SidCowanslovechild
said:
|
... Viva - Laurson? AK - I liked Nobby but not sure he would et in ahead of Ash, Dj and Milner |
Keithc
said:
|
... I'd argue that anyone doubting Milner's quality hasn't watched him this season, or is at least watching him only in passing. He's improved leaps and bounds with the ball at his feet, and is providing better delivery than last season. That said, there was a definite difference in the quality of service once Downing entered the game, which is a very hopeful development indeed. |
vivavilla
said:
|
... ak_27 I don't quite understand the massive Solano love myself. He was our best player the time he was with us but that doesn't say a lot at all. He reminded me a little bit of a good version of Kieran Dyer. SidCowanslovechild Our defence is better now than it was with Laursen. If you offered him to me complete with 2007 form I wouldn't exactly turn him away, but we're doing perfectly well without him. |
neil57
said:
|
... Milner,Ash and DJ are part of the future of our fine club. Solano was only a stopgap. Man City are so like keegans Newcastle of 15 years ago. KK's philosophy was, "we'll score more than you". Not like that now. I see great things for Villa. I think Chris, JPA and Robin prob agree, many more too. Away for a glass of wine. UTV |
villa@herts
said:
|
... ak_27 says "Give me Salano over Milner or Young any day of the week". Now I know you are having a laugh. Dont you recall Salano saying he would walk back to Newcastle if he had to, to get away from Villa. And you want that type of player. Even with the skills he had, which had left him by the time he came to us, I dont want players who dont want to play for the Villa and give there all. That's why I support the use of home grown players. |
Juan Pablo Angel
said:
|
... How anyone can say anything good about that O'Leary side astounds me. Old or not good enough. Laursen only got fit after Mon turned up so not fair to include him. Ridgewell played most. We are decent and we'll beat Spurs. We will also beat Portsmouth and I fancy our chances against Man U too. |
VDV
said:
 |
... is all we need is a top class striker in january, 15 to 20 mil. not jay bothroyed or a 15 year old from barnsley at top class striker and its time oneill brings one in as arsenal, united, liverpool, chelsea,spurs and man city have one or more. goals win games and good strikers get goals. wake up oneill and get one please. a top center mid is needed as well. |
villa@herts
said:
|
... Well said JPA. I am pleased I decided to revisit the site. In every way we have improved all that we now need is to play a natural goal scorer. What are you doing on Saturday Juan? |
Geoff
said:
|
... That signing ticked me off: Spurs getting Krancjar. That guy is GOOD, and he was signed on the cheap because nobody knows who he is. He would really have added a new dimension to Villa, and hes a quality player. As far as Young, Agbonlahor, and Milner being inconsistent, remember: These guys are still relatively young, and they are NOT yet in their primes. It is imperative that they be kept together and allowed to gel over time. Firing MON and overhauling the roster AGAIN would be a VERY foolish idea and would restart the teams development ALL OVER AGAIN. Do you want Villa to suck again? No. Stick with this guy, and give him the ammunition (transfer funds) he needs to succeed. I mean, Mark Hughes is a TERRIBLE manager and that team is halfway decent for a bunch of gutless mercenaries because they spent a ton of money. There arent many managers I trust with a limited budget (see Benitez, Rafael - he needs a massive amount of money to spend otherwise he will screw up), but MON is one of them. His bad signings are usually cheapo signings anyways, and not a big money flop. |
Geoff
said:
|
... I had to watch Sunderland beat Arsenal instead of Villa saturday on Fox Soccer Channel USA. Then they showed the 9-1 Spurs romp on Sunday along with Stoke Vs Portsmouth. Those are some dog dirt terrible games to air. Sunderland was entertaining, but come on.... They BETTER show the Villa Spurs match at least, and Im sure they will show Villa/Man Utd and Villa/Liverpool. |
Geoff
said:
|
... It is very odd that Arsenal - with that brand new beautiful stadium - have not been able to spend really big and may have to let a few guys go elsewhere....thats usually not the case with new stadiums... |
VDV
said:
|
... geoff- i agree but oneill does not spend money wisely how ever much he has. he has had a fair amount of money given to him and i think learner will be disappointed on what oneill has bought and how slow we are building with the money we have spent. some players oneill has bought : hearwood knight heskey reo coker sidwell salifoo shorey all a disasters rednapp defoe keane crouch kranjar all top players we could have got and need. |
henrydouble
said:
 |
... The whole point about the passing is that a team that plays better football is more likely to be successful than a side that punts it every ttime. IF longball football guaranteed us the title i'd take it but it doesn't and it's no coincidence that the 'TOP 4' play better football than everybody else. On MoN i think that he doesn't believe in popping it around because we do have the players to do it. West Ham and Fulham play nicer football than us but are you saying their players are better technically than ours??? I don't think so. Under MoN we're guaranteed top 6 but anything more is a lottery. It would be a shame if after building such a good squad, he didn't finish it off by making the simple step forward. If MoN was to go the next manager would have to pinch himself inheriting that squad... so here's to hoping he does it. Btw i'm expecting a win vs Spuds because that's a trademarck of Villa under MoN, winning wen it isn't expected. |
VDV
said:
|
... its time oneill gets players like defoes, keanes, crouches, kranjares, and santa cruses when they are available and stops leaving teams like spurs to get them. we have the money, we have some top players here, great stadium and fans but do we have the right manager to get them in ? surly if we did they would be here by now. |
Pancho Villan
said:
 |
...Villa_Chris said: er....... sorry about that, I was having a bad day My posting was a bit like the Burnley performance. I need to get rid of the ineffective Sidwell type words like 'pedantic' and replace them with hard-hitting Coker type words Up The Villa |
Keithc
said:
|
... Geoff, I agree, but I honestly do think he was always going to Spurs- he had a good history with Redknapp, it's not that much of a move from the coast to London, Spurs have more dosh for wages, etc. |
Keithc
said:
|
... VDV. . . awesome analysis. Way to pit MON's worst signings (and I'd argue that NRC doesn't qualify for "disaster" status) against Redknapp's best. Fair play to Redknapp for undoing his predecessor's mistakes in getting Keane and Defoe back at Spurs, but of the four Spurs buys you listed, he had managed 3 before and two had been at the club before, meaning he likely had the inside edge on all of them. Yes, Redknapp bought Defoe and Crouch at Pompey when we had a chance, but that purchase, among others, left Portsmouth with some severe debts that they still have yet to pay, and which hamstrung the team in the last two transfer windows. While yes, I want Villa to win silverware, but not at the cost of the team ceasing to exist, or be forced to exist as a shell of itself. I'll take O'Neill's slow and steady approach. |
Fatkevs
said:
 |
... How many fans on here actually enjoy watching football, so many support hit & hope saying flowing football does not matter as long as we get a point or 2. I agree there is little that equals the thrill of scoring, but there is much more to a game than that as long as we have such a high % of glory hunters for fans we will never see the beatifull game down VP |
ak_27
said:
|
... Sorry but Nobby had ability that Milner and Young just do not have in my opinion. Not having a go at Milner as he has improved hugely since he joined but they do have the creativity that Nobby had. He was sheer class for a while and yes he wanted to go back to Newcastle but we are talking about ability here. Solano was just more complete as a player. |
VDV
said:
|
... keitic- what players has oneill actually bought that are the quality of defoe keane crouch and kranjar ? rednapp has been at spurs for a season and a bit and look at them. oneill has been here for almost four years and look at us. that slow building you want will be damm slow if we dont by quality like rednapp has. |
Badger
said:
|
...as long as we have such a high % of glory hunters for fans Eh? I hardly think you can call any Villa fan a glory hunter. If you're talking about people who want us to win stuff, I would have thought that's everybody. I do know what you mean about the style of play though. Whilst I'd love us to play like arsenal, I want results first and don't care if the football is scruffy, as long as we're winning. I can justify it if we do win. But perhaps that's why some of us get so hacked off when we play rubbish and lose? The way I see it is you have to get CL to get that extra pot of money, which leads to better players, which leads to hopefully better football. And I don't care how we get it, unfortunately. It's quite sad I suppose, but if you're not in that elite, as many have said on here, the whole thing is pointless these days. |
Steveo
said:
 |
... lets get rid of o'neill redknapp does it so much better. lets try and get wenger, pep guardiola or carlo first but if we can't lets just tap harry up im sure he will come. we also want skillful passing prima donna footballers dont we so lets have a big clear out while were at it too, out with carew young milner gabby and in with fabiano nilmar kanoute robben. 4th is just not good enough and i want changes to happen as of tommorrow ! |
Keithc
said:
|
... VDV- Carew, Milner, Young, Downing, Dunne, and Collins, for starters Also, revisit my post above regarding the team that both managers inherited. O'Neill's had a much bigger job to do than Redknapp, in terms of reshaping the team. |
mikey18
said:
|
... AK-27 in reply, When Diarra signed for portsmouth he said it was a stepping stone to greater things...Do we want a player like this at our club, even for one season? personally i don't think short-term fixes are the answer..see portsmouth. Also Diarra was passed up by Arsene Wenger (probably the best manager in the world when it comes to developing youth) and Jose Mourhino another manager known for bringing players through (his porto side that won the champions league) why? you have to ask yourself. Finally Diarra is a world class holding midfielder, but don't you think we need playmaker? I don't think we need a poll for this, we are crying out for a box to box midfielder. I'd rather Jimmy Bullard for 5mil id im honest. |
mikey18
said:
|
... Manchester Utd didn't win the league or the champions league because they were the best passers of the ball, they won it because they could grind out results, win games in injury time and had a great squad of youth, experience a hard working and never say did philosophy. Much like our own id say. Barcelona are the exception Xavi, Iniesta, Messi, are 3 of the best footballers in the land. But even they came unstuck now and again. Rubin Kazan is a prime example of a great counter attacking team that got the better of them. Adieu and farewell |
VDV
said:
|
... keitic- your saying carew will get 20 goals a season like defoe? you say about your post about oneill having a harder job than rednapp . is this an exuse for oneill not getting top strikers and midfielders. oneill makes his job so much harder because he does not bring top players in. i really believe that oneill would be brilliant if he had players like defoe and keane for villa. hes had chances to get them. he has no exuse. |
VDV
said:
|
... keitic- also in that list there is no top center midfielder that oneill has bought in. isn't that a key posistion? i seem to remember a top center mid leaving villa but still has not been replaced. remember when modric got injured, three days later rednapp replaced him with kranjar. oneill had three months to replce barry but did he? |
mikey18
said:
|
... Also just a few facts for all of you people who see a 9-1 headline and rush to suggest spurs players are better than our players. despite lennon getting 4 assists and a goal yesterday he is still level on 6 assists with james milner and scored one more goal. Last season Milner and Young got 9 assists, which was more Lennon and equal to Modric. Gabby has outscored defoe on average over the last two seasons. |
Keithc
said:
|
... funny you should mention that, VDV, because Carew scored more goals last season than Defoe did (11 to 10). And it looks as if either Downing or Milner will be replacing Barry in the central midfield position. |
Steveo
said:
|
... defoe knew villa were interested he still chose that london club like most top footballers do wake up man top top players dont see villa as big club like us fans do also o'neill has signed a number of players who have aleady stated that it was the chance of working with o'neill that they came to our club |
ak_27
said:
|
... Micky Utd grind out results because they do not give the ball away the way we do. The less the oppossition have it the less chance they have to score. That way when you are playing poorly they can still win if they score one. They score late in games as they have more engery left as they haven't been chasing the oppossiition for the 90mins. That plus the ref plays as much added time as is neccessary for them to get the winner. As for Diarra another midfielder that wasn't good enough for Wenger and Mourinho was non other then Sidwell. Just so you know Wenger did not want to sell Diarra but he wasn't willing to sit on the bench which i see as a good trait in a footballer. If you are offered a really good player for 5m you take it. It will be a long time before we have a player like that willing to join for such a little ammount of money. I do like Bullard though and i thought we should have gone for him in Jan. He would have linked up with Petrov and Barry very well. |
Keithc
said:
|
... And Carew scored more the year before (13 to 12). Yes, he's nine shy this year, but Defoe also has played more games, and just had a striker's dream match. |
VDV
said:
|
... keithc- would you really be happy with either milner or downing who are known for there WING abililty to play in cener mid. If young gets injured for 4 weeks or so, and we put downing on the left then who will go in cener mid for four weeks who will do a good job. Reo, no sidwell nno, gardner no, delph will do eventully. Or would you rather get vandervaart or defour to play in center mid. We cant put wingers in center mid. Oneill has to go out and buy a top center mid. |
VDV
said:
|
... Ok carew might of out scored defoe the last two seasons but its this season that matters. Can you really see carew outscoring defoe this one or even agbonglahor for that matter ? Oneill should get vagner love. |
Keithc
said:
|
... Considering that Milner has played in center mid for the England U21s, for now, yes, I would be thrilled to have him in CM. On the second question, yes, I would put Nigel Reo-Coker into central midfield in a heartbeat. Would I be glad to also have Defour or van der Vaart? Sure. But I've been quite proud to support THIS VILLA TEAM as it stands, and would be regardless of whether or not O'Neill adds either of those midfielders. |
Keithc
said:
|
... Also, Gareth Barry was also considered a WING player before O'Neill arrived, and seemed to do quite well in Villa's central midfield. |
mikey18
said:
|
... AK_27, your perspective on Man Utd is an interesting one. I believe they grind out wins because they have a very dependable back four and they have players that work tirelessly until the final whistle in Rooney, Ji Sung Park, Flethcher, Anderson to name but a few. But regardless i still think that everything said in the previous post stands. Do you agree? teams should play to their strengths even arsene wenger who manages a current arsenal side who is very capable of passing the ball, also managed the arsenal side which was heckled boring boring arsenal. Why? because he had very good defensively minded players and he used them well. Chelsea play a diamond midfield which by its nature will involve more passing. Liverpool play with one up top which again will involve more passing. Utd play a 4-4-2-ish but with much better players than are own and same with spurs. We don't have a player with tom huddelstones range of passing of technical ability on the ball and we don't use reo-coker like redknapp uses palacious. Palacious turns the ball over so well when spurs are out of possession it isn't for long. |
Keithc
said:
|
... Considering that before that 5 goal outburst Gabby was level with Defoe on goals for the season, yes, VDV, I could see Gabby outscoring Defoe. |
r0bb0
said:
 |
... ak27, You say you now "detest" the way we play and for the first time since you've been a Villa fan you "can't be bothered to watch any more." I assume you've been a fan for a number of years....you surely can't think that our football now is worse than in O'Leary's last year? Your comments seem to go beyond doubts about MoN as a manager, you seem to have a deep dislike of the man himself. Is that the case, and if so, where does this deep dislike spring from? |
King VOGRA
said:
 |
... One of MON's biggest gaffs was not signing Defoe when he went to Pompey, and i for one was stating that at the time, a pure 20 goals a season scorer, Carew and Defoe up front...magic |
r0bb0
said:
|
... ak27. Assuming you had your way and Mon was to leave, how confident can we be that his replacement would actually improve things. Your previous call was for him to be replaced by Martinez. I remember it well because I publically agreed with you. It's not looking such a good call now, and whilst he may still come good it's looking distinctly less likely. Swansea are in the play off places in the Championship despite losing a couple of their best players so it doesn't look as if he was essential to their success. Would we be in 5th place if Martinez had come here? I now doubt it. Assuming MoN were to leave, who would you want to replace him with? |
ak_27
said:
|
... Robbo i guess the thing that makes me not like MON is that ive been waiting a long time for the end of Doug and his ways. And in my opinion what do we get but yet another dinosaur of the game. I'll admit i was happy when he became our manager but for me it became apart that he was not the manager i thought he was(really poor transfer decisions made in the first 2 seasons). I just believe that we will not succeed with a manager with his tactical weakness, outdated football philosphy, backward transfer policy, total disregard for modern use of squads and an increasingly stubborn side which is leading to falling out with players and also the complacency of the untoucables performances on the pitch who are never droped no matter what. The thing is the football is brutal to watch and really is just so predictable from the style to the introduction of Heskey as the only sub at 60mins in every game. It is effective on occassion but uneffective on many others and i just don't see him taking us higher unless he changes certain things which go againest his beliefs. To me he is holding us back. He actually would have been great under Ellis but he is just not good enough now with the funds we have and spent to date. Regarding who i would bring in it would have to be Hiddink. Regarding Martinez im still a fan. He took a big blow yesterday but we will see what he is made of. Im confident he will be a very very good manger. That team isn't his. He has lost 3 of his top players in the summer and they are doing well enough for Wigan. They have beaten Chelsea at home and drew with City at home and have beaten us and also Burnley away. His is doing a good job so far and he will learn from yesterday. |
Badger
said:
|
... VDV, oneill had three months to replce barry but did he? You're making it up now mate. It was well documented that Barry had given indications that he was going to stay. MON said so himself and it was a genuine shock to everyone at the club when he decided to go. As for the comments about Solano, yes, good player. But the reason he had to leave Villa was because he was under orders from the missus, after she found out he was having an affair*. It was either leave Birmingham or she would leave him. She ended up leaving him anyway, iirc. *As was DOL (some young barmaid). Strangely, I have no interest in celebrity gossip whatsoever, unless it's the Villa. |
holteend paul
said:
 |
... who the hell gives a flying fook what a comedian thinks about aston villa as a comedian is just a modern day jester who are paid to make his betters laugh!!! to be honest i dont think he is particulary funny as i really do prefer jack dee or peter kay. |
ak_27
said:
|
... Badger you'll know this so. Did Gabby actually get 3 different woman pregnant at the same time? |
Badger
said:
|
...Badger you'll know this so. Did Gabby actually get 3 different woman pregnant at the same time? I read the story, but I'm not convinced myself. Struck me as 3 young tarts trying to score some money. As for Solano and DOL, I got my info from various sources, not just the press  In fact I'm not sure I heard about them in the press at all. I only posted those comments to sidetrack things and lighten the mood a bit, tbh. And in my opinion what do we get but yet another dinosaur of the game See, I have a problem with this. You say MON is a dinosaur, but what did he achieve as a footballer? And what about wenger? He never even played. At least MON did and achieved a lot. really poor transfer decisions made in the first 2 seasons We'll definitely have to agree to disagree on this one. Yes, there were some crap signings, but they were necessary as backup, imo. The likes of Salifou and Routledge are often mentioned on here, but they cost less than a mill between them! Both were gambles that didn't come off. That's the way it goes. Look at some of the shit that Benitez has bought, for example. And for major money too. |
Badger
said:
|
... I meant to say what did Hiddinck achieve as a footballer. Not that I'm saying Hiddinck and wEnger are crap |
ak_27
said:
|
... I think Roy Keane is well on the way to proving that a good footballer more often then not are not great managers. Regarding the dinosaur remark it has to do with his appoach to the game in a lot of area's which i feel are from a different era. ie 1997. I don't think what he achieved 30 yeas ago on the pitch has much relevance to the game today really. If his mentor and the inreality the man he based on Clough can become outdated in football then MON can also. I just don't see him being able to adapt and learn. Do you? Has he learned from driving the same 13 players into the ground last season and the year before? Fergie has adapted and moved with the times which is why he is so successful. He knows you cannot primarily limit yourself to one small pool of over priced under skilled players and succeed in todays game. |
Badger
said:
|
...If his mentor and the in reality the man he based on Clough can become outdated in football then MON can also. I just don't see him being able to adapt and learn. Do you? Has he learned from driving the same 13 players into the ground last season and the year before? Fergie has adapted and moved with the times which is why he is so successful. He knows you cannot primarily limit yourself to one small pool of over priced under skilled players and succeed in todays game. This is where I'll have to disagree again. Clough was one of the best managers ever, full stop. But it wasn't for his footballing nous. It was for the way he managed players. Peter Taylor was the savvy fooballing brain. MON has learnt from Clough, I agree. I personally think Clough's problem was he got fed up with the way the game was going. That mixed with his love of Whiskey. I could tell you some stories there, but it's a different subject. As for Ferguson, he was shit at Man U for a long time and most fans wanted him out. Whilst we haven't reached that point yet (you have to accept you're very much in the minority here) I see similarities. MON will do the bizz, imo and I really don't see anyone doing a better job. |
86villain
said:
 |
... Just responding o somebodies comment on Stefan Moore, signing for Halesowen is a little revival for him last season he played in the Birmingham sunday league. I worked with his Aunt who said his fall from grace is mainly due to his Mrs being a general pain in the arse and not letting him do anyhting, he was offered a contract by an australian team, Sydney i think and she turned it down saying if he went she wouldnt go and he couldnt see his kid or something. She also told me the reason Luke left was because he was bored with Villa and to be fair he had been with us 13 years |
Nanwasafan
said:
 |
... ak 27 I think Fergie is wrong and MON is right. Surely, everyone agrees, you can'limit yourself to one small pool of over priced underskilled players.' Just out of interest which players in the Villa squad do you believe are under skilled and over priced? |
davidc
said:
|
... AK27 just wants a shiny new foreign manager folks. Doesn't matter what the facts say, or how much we try to persuade him. In his simplistic eyes, foreign players are silky on the ball, great passers, and therefore yards ahead of British players. And as for managers. Well anyone with any sense can see that foreign managers are all tactical innovators and visionaries, whereas British ones are all long-ball dinosaurs. Life is great when its so simple ain't it? |
ak_27
said:
|
... Davidc you seem to think that England is full to the brim of top quality footballers. I can tell you, you are not. It wasn't too long ago after they failed to qualify for the Euro's that there was an out cry in the media about the lack of talent coming through. Now i actually didn't agree with that over reaction as there are some very good players in England but they are all at the top 4 clubs already. And that is how it will continue. So we end up really with the second level of English footballer. That alone will not be enough to compete with the top 4. The likes of Downing, Milner, Young and Gabby will all be there or there abouts in the WC sqaud but none are really guarinteed to play. They may play but they would generally be regarded by the other top teams as the weaklinks in the English team. My view on this has nothing to do with what country the players are from but the facts are the English game is being fished by too many big clubs thus leaving the chances of bringing in the big fish slim enough. Nan for me a lot of the players MON has bought have cost a lot. Not all have been poor but the fact that they are English has put the price way up. Davies, Milner, Warnock, Downing to name a few have cost a lot and while some have been sucessful their European equilivant would have cost half. How much did Vidic cost? How much did Evra cost? Clichy, Obertan (looks very good), Helb, i could go on about most of the Arsenal team really. These are the teams that have more money then us and this is how they are building their team. To me it just doesn't make sense to limit yourself to a smaller pool of talent. As for a foreign manager i couldn't care less where he comes from as long as he is talented. And by that i mean tactically and has the right view on the game. And yes i will never be happy with MON at thisclub unless he actually does something to change my mind. I just fundamentally disagree with a lot of his approaches to the English game in this day and age. |
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